Onslaught Onslaught Server Discussion

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Old 11-21-2017, 01:49 PM   #1
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Some talk about un-reg's and tickrate here.

Created this thread for reporting purposes.

Tickrate is now 45. Please provide feedback in this thread.
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Old 11-21-2017, 05:08 PM   #2
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I don't think the change took, tick is still displayed as 26.
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Old 11-21-2017, 08:53 PM   #3
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Can someone explain ticket rate to me?
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Old 11-22-2017, 04:30 PM   #4
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Sit down, put your hand on your knee then bring it to your forehead. This will take some amount of time T, and the location of your hand is continuous over the interval [0, T]. That is for any point in time t in the interval [0,T], your hand exists in a location L. Well, continuity is more than that, but you get the idea... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Continuous_function

Anyway, a UT server is not like that, but like a claymation or stopmotion movie where the end product is a composite of discrete frames. Each one of these frames is known as a "tick". And player's avatar locations are only updated at these discrete points in time. Now, if the object is not moving very fast or far over the interval time, there is not much of a problem. But when the tick rate is too low or the movement speed of players (or *cough* broken AF vehicles *cough*) is too high, continuity is broken.

Now you may be thinking, but wait Goose, if this is the case then why don't I see people skipping around or rough animation. And the reason for that is client side interpolation and prediction. So your client likely runs at a higher framerate than the server tickrate, and it will animate accordingly. But it also predicts player location based upon the last received motion vector for that actor from the server. This is why when the server crashes all the vehicles and players keep going in a straight line.

The upshot is that while entities appear to be ever present and more or less continuous client side, they in fact only exist (for hit registration purposes) in those discrete locations. So if a player moves from point A to point C at a high rate of speed and a relatively low tick, and you aim at point B somewhere and the middle and shoot them, the shot may not register because their character model did not (and will never) actually exist at that location B despite being animated continuously through that point on your client. This is what makes fast movement game breaking.

You could just up the tick, but you will run out of bandwidth quite quickly on multiplayer servers.

Now if the engine was smart, the server would run at a much higher tick internally (say 1000) or do some location interpolation for hit registration purposes, and only replicate at a reasonable external tick to the clients to save on bandwidth. But apparently the people at Epic did not think that was a good idea....

Last edited by -Goose-; 11-22-2017 at 06:11 PM..
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Old 11-25-2017, 10:50 AM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by -Goose- View Post
Sit down, put your hand on your knee then bring it to your forehead. This will take some amount of time T, and the location of your hand is continuous over the interval [0, T]. That is for any point in time t in the interval [0,T], your hand exists in a location L. Well, continuity is more than that, but you get the idea... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Continuous_function

Anyway, a UT server is not like that, but like a claymation or stopmotion movie where the end product is a composite of discrete frames. Each one of these frames is known as a "tick". And player's avatar locations are only updated at these discrete points in time. Now, if the object is not moving very fast or far over the interval time, there is not much of a problem. But when the tick rate is too low or the movement speed of players (or *cough* broken AF vehicles *cough*) is too high, continuity is broken.

Now you may be thinking, but wait Goose, if this is the case then why don't I see people skipping around or rough animation. And the reason for that is client side interpolation and prediction. So your client likely runs at a higher framerate than the server tickrate, and it will animate accordingly. But it also predicts player location based upon the last received motion vector for that actor from the server. This is why when the server crashes all the vehicles and players keep going in a straight line.

The upshot is that while entities appear to be ever present and more or less continuous client side, they in fact only exist (for hit registration purposes) in those discrete locations. So if a player moves from point A to point C at a high rate of speed and a relatively low tick, and you aim at point B somewhere and the middle and shoot them, the shot may not register because their character model did not (and will never) actually exist at that location B despite being animated continuously through that point on your client. This is what makes fast movement game breaking.

You could just up the tick, but you will run out of bandwidth quite quickly on multiplayer servers.

Now if the engine was smart, the server would run at a much higher tick internally (say 1000) or do some location interpolation for hit registration purposes, and only replicate at a reasonable external tick to the clients to save on bandwidth. But apparently the people at Epic did not think that was a good idea....
Cool, never knew this. I figured we were all seeing something slightly different than what's actually happening considering our internet connections, but I didnt know it was rapid-fire plots on a graph (tick) in addition to the time delay (ping).
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Old 11-27-2017, 02:41 PM   #6
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Quote:
You could just up the tick, but you will run out of bandwidth quite quickly on multiplayer servers.
So a higher tick rate could even make the problem worse?

What side effects of a higher tick rate should we look for (besides the unregistered shots)?

It did seem like last night there were more unregistered shots than previously IMO.
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Old 11-27-2017, 02:55 PM   #7
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So a higher tick rate could even make the problem worse?
No. You will always get better hit registration with a higher tick (assuming the server maintains it). The downside is when you run out of bandwidth, the server starts prioritizing what data it sends you and some stuff that normally gets sent, no longer gets sent. This typically leads to invisible projectiles... tank shells you can't see, rockets you can't see, shock balls you can't see, etc. Of course, all that stuff is still real, and when you die to invisible rockets or tank shell etc, they are legitimate shots, however you never got the chance to outplay them because the server thought it was more important to constantly update the position of that spider mine chasing you. Now, in ONS (especially OMNI ONS) I would say this is a reasonable tradeoff to make because invisible or not, you are not going to "outplay" a PPC shell, or a Mino shell, or a Hurricane shell, etc, etc, etc... So will you die to invisible shit you can not see more often, yes. But it will be legit invisible shit that you probably had zero chance of outplaying anyway. On the plus side, more of your shots will also count and some of them will be invisible to the enemy.


But all of this is moot because AFAICS, the server is still at the same 26 tick it has always been.
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Old 11-27-2017, 06:38 PM   #8
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Originally Posted by -Goose- View Post


But all of this is moot because AFAICS, the server is still at the same 26 tick it has always been.
It's been raised, quite a bit.

http://forum.omnipotents.com/showthread.php?t=15148
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Old 11-27-2017, 06:52 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by {glr}pooty View Post
So a higher tick rate could even make the problem worse?

What side effects of a higher tick rate should we look for (besides the unregistered shots)?

It did seem like last night there were more unregistered shots than previously IMO.
http://wiki.unrealadmin.org/Netspeed..._this_together
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Old 11-27-2017, 08:55 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lagzilla
It's been raised, quite a bit.
Except it has not. As of 8:54PM 11-27-2017, the server tick is still displayed as max 26 (hint: the server tick is displayed right under the server version). Although, I know reading can be difficult for some people.
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Old 11-27-2017, 10:45 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by -Goose- View Post
Except it has not. As of 8:54PM 11-27-2017, the server tick is still displayed as max 26 (hint: the server tick is displayed right under the server version). Although, I know reading can be difficult for some people.
Or maybe I am going off of what the server admin in the mentioned post. I had no reason to validate and I am sure its an oversight he will correct. Have you also considered the possibility that others may not know where to look for this information?

The more important question, which I think I have the answer to, are you a dick full time or just in game related stuff?
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Old 11-27-2017, 11:02 PM   #12
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are you a dick full time
Nah, just to people who deserve it.
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Old 11-29-2017, 08:58 AM   #13
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Ok, it's changed now.

Sorry for the botch up, apparently one can't change the tickrate on the fly in the ut2004.ini.

Once again, please comment/report in this thread on the revised tickrate (now 45).
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Old 11-29-2017, 11:13 PM   #14
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Been going over 10000 incoming bytes in almost all games, meaning seeing warping players/projectiles, etc. Was not just me.
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Old 11-30-2017, 01:10 PM   #15
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Well, like Goose said, increasing the ticky rate might help with unregistered shots, but will probably result in more invisible projectiles/gunfire. Indeed I noticed that last night, but did not experience as many unregistered shots I've seen lately. I would gladly trade invisible fire for having my shots count.

One thing that did happen, not sure it's related... I was gunning in the mino, jumped out to heal it and I was suddenly like a hundred yards away from it, way behind it, nowhere near close enough to heal it.
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Old 11-30-2017, 07:33 PM   #16
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Yeah, I had a few weird things happen last night too... I'll pay more attention tonight and see if I can figure out exactly what is not right. It seemed like I wasn't where I thought I should be a bit more, and I seemed to die more quickly without realizing what was going on somehow.
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Old 12-01-2017, 04:18 PM   #17
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It seemed like more effects on the "Heavy" maps (MTMU, Junkyards) whereas things seemed much better all around on lighter maps like bathroom, Tanks Alot.
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Old 12-01-2017, 11:13 PM   #18
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Game isn't playable with a full server. Warping, people not in locations they appear to be. Tops of vehicles not loading, no firing indication, not always sure if anything is hitting or what fire mode I'm in (Hammerhead tank fire vs minigun) etc.
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Old 12-01-2017, 11:44 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Xexx View Post
Game isn't playable with a full server. Warping, people not in locations they appear to be. Tops of vehicles not loading, no firing indication, not always sure if anything is hitting or what fire mode I'm in (Hammerhead tank fire vs minigun) etc.
So nothing changed?
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Old 12-02-2017, 02:06 AM   #20
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Bad news, odd behavior on the server. Shots not visible, primarily from beam vehicles, weird warping behavior, I enjoy the new bonus of suddenly facing the opposite direction I was a tenth of a second before. I think it needs to be lowered a bit to see where this lands. There has to be a balance between goofy behavior and unreg shots.

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