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Old 01-29-2018, 03:17 PM   #141
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...I don't want to pollute his thread anymore than I have already. Since he is designing the map and doing an update I don't want to put him into the position of having to deal with me blathering about what I want to see in his map ...
Nah, it ain't like that. I'm gonna make some changes to Nightwolf and then upload for people to check out before trying to get it on the server. If people don't like it then I think we should use the version Anon updated the teleporters on and put aside my previous changes.
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Old 01-31-2018, 02:50 PM   #142
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So I've got a question. I would like to set up Nightwolf so that some of the vehicles change depending on who owns the node. I'm trying to make it a little easier to dig yourself out of being pushed back to your base. Problem is I have to use a different factory for each vehicle per team and that means that if the other team's vehicles are still alive from a node that was destroyed then rebuilt by the other team then all the vehicles for the new team will be there. Not sure I'm explaining this well but if you know what I mean does anyone have a problem with it?

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Happens with the hammer head at the primary as well, but I agree, it is more of an issue in the dragon version of the map.

A
Do you think I should do something on Nightwolf? It wouldn't be very hard to add a teleporter to the roof.
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Old 01-31-2018, 03:07 PM   #143
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So I've got a question. I would like to set up Nightwolf so that some of the vehicles change depending on who owns the node. I'm trying to make it a little easier to dig yourself out of being pushed back to your base. Problem is I have to use a different factory for each vehicle per team and that means that if the other team's vehicles are still alive from a node that was destroyed then rebuilt by the other team then all the vehicles for the new team will be there. Not sure I'm explaining this well but if you know what I mean does anyone have a problem with it?



Do you think I should do something on Nightwolf? It wouldn't be very hard to add a teleporter to the roof.
I think so. So the potential problem you're describing is that there will potentially be more vehicles in use on a map than there are spawn points for them? If so, I don't see a problem with that.
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Old 01-31-2018, 06:36 PM   #144
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The Ultimate Vehicle Factory behaves oddly, but I am confused easily and the whole factory for each vehicle thing is throwing me off... One factory - One dif vehicle per team + possibility to have previous team spawned vehicle active on map?
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Old 02-01-2018, 01:00 PM   #145
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The Ultimate Vehicle Factory behaves oddly, but I am confused easily and the whole factory for each vehicle thing is throwing me off... One factory - One dif vehicle per team + possibility to have previous team spawned vehicle active on map?
Okay so I'm just going to tell how I think it is that Nightwolf is currently screwed up and if someone abuses it, oh well. I used one factory for each Nexus/Pali. That means that if you build the node then take the Pali/Crusader you can deny the other team a nexus, even though you might not have one. Some may not think this is a problem but I think it's pretty messed up. I have a fix ready that just removes the Pali but I hate to make the admins do the work for just that one thing.

So what that means is any time you use one factory to give a team different vehicles depending on who owns the node that the vehicle that can potentially be denied when the one that spawns there is still alive is going to be different from the one that is still alive. I don't like that, hence different factories for different sides. This is only for a few vehicles. I don't plan on doing the whole map that way. For instance...

One of the complaints of this map is it's hard to make a comeback. What about another Ion tank at the left side primary but only for the team on that side. The other team gets a Goliath or Cobra or something. The normal Ion tank could also only spawn if that node is on your side of the map, etc.
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Old 02-01-2018, 02:08 PM   #146
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Okay so I'm just going to tell how I think it is that Nightwolf is currently screwed up and if someone abuses it, oh well. I used one factory for each Nexus/Pali. That means that if you build the node then take the Pali/Crusader you can deny the other team a nexus, even though you might not have one. Some may not think this is a problem but I think it's pretty messed up. I have a fix ready that just removes the Pali but I hate to make the admins do the work for just that one thing.

So what that means is any time you use one factory to give a team different vehicles depending on who owns the node that the vehicle that can potentially be denied when the one that spawns there is still alive is going to be different from the one that is still alive. I don't like that, hence different factories for different sides. This is only for a few vehicles. I don't plan on doing the whole map that way. For instance...

One of the complaints of this map is it's hard to make a comeback. What about another Ion tank at the left side primary but only for the team on that side. The other team gets a Goliath or Cobra or something. The normal Ion tank could also only spawn if that node is on your side of the map, etc.
That sounds good. I'd go with a hurricaine (or two) though... can take down nodes quickly but can also stand a chance against flyers unlike the ion.
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Old 02-01-2018, 04:22 PM   #147
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That sounds good. I'd go with a hurricaine (or two) though... can take down nodes quickly but can also stand a chance against flyers unlike the ion.
I like the Ion idea, you could always use the weak one to make it easier to kill on foot if ppl are worried.

Hurricanes are bugged

A
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Old 02-02-2018, 02:02 PM   #148
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Binger, if I understand correctly, you're wanting to do this to make a comeback more feasible, which is hard to do with just core vehicles or the ones that currently spawn at the primaries.

Sounds like a noble idea, but all the losing team has to do is regain control of 8/9 to get back in it. It's that way on all the minus maps, but unfortunately 75% of the players here don't seem to get that. My point is even putting a powerful vehicle like an ion at that primary won't make a bit of difference if the team still doesn't understand the importance of getting 8/9 under control. All it will do is help the clueless players that want to build that left primary, while the other primary is turning the wrong color.

Seems like a waste of time, unless you just enjoy doing this kind of thing. In that case, go for it. It also seems like an attempt to "balance" things out by giving the losing team an unbalanced vehicle spawn for a chance at a comeback. I'm getting really tired of the word "balance" when it comes to this game. If everything is "balanced", then every match will be a marathon 5 pointer.

So, why not just have 2 or even 3 minos spawn once the team is down to no nodes?
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Old 02-02-2018, 02:18 PM   #149
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Binger, if I understand correctly, you're wanting to do this to make a comeback more feasible, which is hard to do with just core vehicles or the ones that currently spawn at the primaries.

Sounds like a noble idea, but all the losing team has to do is regain control of 8/9 to get back in it. It's that way on all the minus maps, but unfortunately 75% of the players here don't seem to get that. My point is even putting a powerful vehicle like an ion at that primary won't make a bit of difference if the team still doesn't understand the importance of getting 8/9 under control. All it will do is help the clueless players that want to build that left primary, while the other primary is turning the wrong color.

Seems like a waste of time, unless you just enjoy doing this kind of thing. In that case, go for it. It also seems like an attempt to "balance" things out by giving the losing team an unbalanced vehicle spawn for a chance at a comeback. I'm getting really tired of the word "balance" when it comes to this game. If everything is "balanced", then every match will be a marathon 5 pointer.

So, why not just have 2 or even 3 minos spawn once the team is down to no nodes?
Minos with friggin lasers on their heads... wait a sec...
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Old 02-02-2018, 02:26 PM   #150
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which is hard to do with just core vehicles or the ones that currently spawn at the primaries.
In that thought, it seems on many of the minus versions (and even randomizer) you end up with Paladins at the base (worthless) or even Aegis (almost worthless) when trying to stage a comeback. Seems like when the team is getting beaten badly, you spawn in the base and you get a selection of Paladin type vehicles...even a simple badger or goliath II (no point in original Goliath tanks...too inaccurate given the other vehicles) would be welcome.

The other thought expressed last night (I think) is a version without PPC spam tanks. They generally sit out of site and just repeatedly spam the nodes. At least even with the Mino it has to be exposed.
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Old 02-02-2018, 03:50 PM   #151
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PPC tanks ruin every map they are in. Death from beyond the fog... sucks
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Old 02-02-2018, 08:47 PM   #152
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Old 02-02-2018, 09:41 PM   #153
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In that thought, it seems on many of the minus versions (and even randomizer) you end up with Paladins at the base (worthless) or even Aegis (almost worthless) when trying to stage a comeback. Seems like when the team is getting beaten badly, you spawn in the base and you get a selection of Paladin type vehicles...even a simple badger or goliath II (no point in original Goliath tanks...too inaccurate given the other vehicles) would be welcome.

The other thought expressed last night (I think) is a version without PPC spam tanks. They generally sit out of site and just repeatedly spam the nodes. At least even with the Mino it has to be exposed.
I mostly agree about being stuck with crappy paladin-type vehicles, however, it's nice to have one or two to block the core in case it becomes vulnerable.. I've saved the core a few times by shielding it. If you get a double shield going with another player, the core is pretty much safe until the primary is re-claimed.

But yes an upgrade on core vehicles would be nice. They should either be offensive or fast movers. Turret tanks, nuke tanks, and most paladins are kind of a bummer there.
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Old 02-05-2018, 10:18 AM   #154
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PPC tanks ruin every map they are in. Death from beyond the fog... sucks
You are failing to consider the joy Bubba Fart gets out of them.

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Old 02-05-2018, 04:58 PM   #155
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Like Pooty said, at least you can see the mino most of the time.
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Old 02-07-2018, 10:22 AM   #156
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... All it will do is help the clueless players that want to build that left primary, while the other primary is turning the wrong color...
OMFG, there needs to be a rule book cause I hear it shouted every time this situation occurs.

The only thing worse is the CLUELESS MINO driver when this occurs that wants to do a stealth attack and drives out of the core to the left, all the F'in way to a locked node, meanwhile the right primary is hot and the core is being attacked, LOL!

Actual, anytime the mino driver does this it pisses me off, such a pussy mino driver move, then he shouts, "when you gonna get that right corner node up, so I can blast this here far corner left node". What a FUCKIN IDIOT!

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Old 02-08-2018, 11:46 AM   #157
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OMFG, there needs to be a rule book cause I hear it shouted every time this situation occurs.

The only thing worse is the CLUELESS MINO driver when this occurs that wants to do a stealth attack and drives out of the core to the left, all the F'in way to a locked node, meanwhile the right primary is hot and the core is being attacked, LOL!

Actual, anytime the mino driver does this it pisses me off, such a pussy mino driver move, then he shouts, "when you gonna get that right corner node up, so I can blast this here far corner left node". What a FUCKIN IDIOT!
There is a rulebook... it's called The Art of War. It was written 2500 years ago, and there's good reason why it's still in the top ten of "military classics" on West Point's Officer's Professional Reading Guide. Many successful business leaders also cite this book as integral in developing their strategic thinking skills.

And there's the real problem McLovin, there's a LOT of players here that are just lacking in strategic thinking. This applies to many more maps than MTMU, like all of them... there's always going to be a path of least resistance in getting to the core and it's usually the best one to take, if only you can get others to listen to sound strategy and use a little teamwork. I know there's often more than one way to the core like on MTMU, but how many times have you seen a 2 point win from building the left primary that's EXPOSED RIGHT IN FRONT OF THE CORE versus building the primary that's shielded by a fucking building? And if you have a team of dimwits that don't understand the sound strategy in trying to get that right hand node back, you're just going to have to resign yourself to losing.

It's like the middle node on MasterBath... people will argue with you that it's worth fighting to get the ion. Sure, it's a powerful weapon in the right hands, but most of the idiots building that node are usually the ones to get in the ion and drop it down to immediately get it killed. Then they'll go right back to building that middle node while the other team is taking over the tub and cabinet primaries. If they would just put that middle node effort into attacking the other team's tub/cabinet primaries, they'd much more likely win.

It never seems to matter how many people you have asking those types of players to please come help at more strategic nodes, they just ignore and keep on shooting their own team in the foot. I think it's usually due to a childish attitude of, "fuck that guy, he's an asshole for telling me what to do so I'm going to do the opposite."
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Old 02-08-2018, 01:18 PM   #158
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... I think it's usually due to a childish attitude of, "fuck that guy, he's an asshole for telling me what to do so I'm going to do the opposite."
I think you are spot on. I'll take Guy as a test case since he is no longer with us and one of the most polarizing players we've have onboard. I believe I even heard him say that he suspected people did this when on his team. They would try to make his team lose just to spite Guy for telling them what to do. I know it sounds a bit paranoid, but I think there was a bit of that going on. Who doesn't want to hear Guy trigger and go into a rage, haha! I suspect it sometimes even now. Especially if they want the match to end and get to another map. They will sand bag until their team loses and it ends quicker. I spectated some and they are off going on a joy ride exploring the countryside.

The real trick, and few have it, I certainly don't. But Guy absolutely had a bit more of that ability than most on the server. That's the ability to motivate people to do the right thing, like that drill sergeant from Full Metal Jacket. Where is THAT guy, he would be awesome to hear barking orders, "What is your major malfunction", "I'm gonna rip your head off and shit down your neck", OMFG I love it. Instead I hear, "Game over man, game over", haha!
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Old 02-09-2018, 12:00 AM   #159
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Ugh, had it happen AGAIN tonight on Nevermore...

How hard is it to understand you have to control 5/6 on that map? I actually had two guys arguing with me, "yeah but one connects to five too." Sure it does, but I have NEVER seen that map won without controlling 5/6... EVER! 5 & 6 connect to two nodes that can cut the map off from the other team... 1/2 only connects to one of them.
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Old 02-11-2018, 09:56 AM   #160
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There is a rulebook... it's called The Art of War. It was written 2500 years ago, and there's good reason why it's still in the top ten of "military classics" on West Point's Officer's Professional Reading Guide. Many successful business leaders also cite this book as integral in developing their strategic thinking skills.

And there's the real problem McLovin, there's a LOT of players here that are just lacking in strategic thinking. This applies to many more maps than MTMU, like all of them... there's always going to be a path of least resistance in getting to the core and it's usually the best one to take, if only you can get others to listen to sound strategy and use a little teamwork. I know there's often more than one way to the core like on MTMU, but how many times have you seen a 2 point win from building the left primary that's EXPOSED RIGHT IN FRONT OF THE CORE versus building the primary that's shielded by a fucking building? And if you have a team of dimwits that don't understand the sound strategy in trying to get that right hand node back, you're just going to have to resign yourself to losing.

It's like the middle node on MasterBath... people will argue with you that it's worth fighting to get the ion. Sure, it's a powerful weapon in the right hands, but most of the idiots building that node are usually the ones to get in the ion and drop it down to immediately get it killed. Then they'll go right back to building that middle node while the other team is taking over the tub and cabinet primaries. If they would just put that middle node effort into attacking the other team's tub/cabinet primaries, they'd much more likely win.

It never seems to matter how many people you have asking those types of players to please come help at more strategic nodes, they just ignore and keep on shooting their own team in the foot. I think it's usually due to a childish attitude of, "fuck that guy, he's an asshole for telling me what to do so I'm going to do the opposite."

This. And QFT
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